PADA: "Prahlad wants to destroy the entire Krishna religion!"

Timothy Lie



Tim Lee / PADA / krishna1008 January 20, 2014:

[Thanks **** prabhu, Thats fine, my point is, before we side with people like Prahlad, we have to look at his Illuminati and other bogus links he is posting..]

Prahlad Das: What "Illuminati' and other bogus links"? Tim blocked me on FaceBook months ago, so he cannot even see what I am posting.

[..his association with GBC clones like Bhakta das..]

Prahlad Das: I have NO association with Bhakta Das: http://padaproblems.blogspot.in/2014/01/bhakta-dasa-missing-link.html

[..etc..]

Prahlad Das: Who is "etc."?

[..and the fact Prahlad wants to destroy the entire Krishna religion by siding with people who say the religion teaches it should kill and chop up child molesting victims. And they sent that odious material to the Dallas courts and New York Times -- to attempt to legally prove that this is what Krishna teaches, and they wanted to prove that legally in Dallas courts. They publicly want to advertise the Krishna religion as a child chopping program, and legally prove that by sending that idea to the Dallas Courts / New York Times etc., they want to destroy the entire religion in public. Fortunately, even karmis know that Krishna does not teach that He wants to have to molested children killed and chopped up, but that is what they want to have promoted in Krishna's name, legally and in court, and in the New York Times etc. They want to legally prove this is a child chopper cult, and they are angry that this did not happen, their plan to destroy the religion by painting as a child murdering cult has not worked, so they are angry. Even Windle Turley, as much as he does not understand things, even he knows Krishna does not teach chopping up children like these guys are teaching in public, New York Times, in court etc..]

Prahlad Das: Complete nonsense. There was NEVER even any "child-chopping" letter to begin with!: http://padaproblems.blogspot.in/2014/01/conversation-about-iskcon-children.html

[..We have to look at the fact Prahlad is living in Vrndavana and complains he is alone and without association..]

Prahlad Das: Is it now a sin to choose to live alone in Vrindavan for some time? I am not complaining. In fact i consider myself very fortunate to have such an opportunity.

[..He cannot do anything except try to take down the ritviks and destroy their preaching. The riviks will have faults, agreed, but before we take them down, we might look at what happens if that is done, then we will have people wandering around with no association, no temples, no programs, no nothing, like Prahlad..]

Prahlad Das: How am I trying to "take down the ritviks and destroy their preaching"?.. Oh, I'm not. That is your job.

[..Right now Bangalore has some books distribution with brahmacharis, just like we had in the old days. They are printing and distributing original books and etc., they are preaching, they are making devotees, and if we assist in taking them down, then we will be another version of Prahlad, we will have nothing. And if that program fails Prahlad would be happy. That is my point. I am not defending anyone's faults, I am saying that if all we do is point to other's faults all the time, then we will have nothing, as Prahlad does..]

Prahlad Das: All Tim Lee has done for the last 30 years is point out other's faults. And if he cannot find any faults he just makes them up!: http://padaproblems.blogspot.in/2014/01/unproven-crazy-accusations-by-tim-lee.html

[..In sum, he should not be our leader or example of how to do things..]

Prahlad Das: I have no desire to become anyone's leader. I am just trying to follow Prabhupada's example of how to do things and encouraging other Prabhupadanugas to do the same. Deviating from Prabhupada's instructions will be the cause of downfall for the Prabhupadanuga 'ritviks'.

[..Bangalore branch temple here has never had any rock and roll music, its not their main emphasis, this whole issue has been overblown by a person who wants to take the whole thing down. He sifts through tons of material to find one fault and he goes ballistic on that, to take us all down, he is not a person we should be promoting, that's my point. ys pd]

Prahlad Das: Who is promoting me? I am not trying to "take the whole thing down". I am just concerned about a few deviations from Srila Prabhupada's instructions that are taking place in Bangalore, as in the rest of ISKCON: http://padaproblems.blogspot.in/2014/01/strong-preaching-was-essence.html

'Fighting Lies With Truth - Not More Lies' by IRM (2000)

It seems ironic that just when so many persons are trying to move out of the past era of GBC untruth and onto the path of truth by joining the IRM, Puranjana is moving in the opposite direction as he progressively degenerates into a vicious circle of lies and more lies. We may have all lied and cheated in the past whilst we were in the illusion of the GBC's bogus program, but Puranjana is doing it NOW in the name of Prabhupada and reform, and he claims to never have been in illusion.

Puranjana does deserve credit for having over the years made many valid criticisms of the GBC and its deviant philosophies. He sees, quite rightly, the current guru system as bogus. However if we claim to want to reform ISKCON, yet indulge in the same type of lying, distortion and egotism we accuse the GBC of, then how will we actually succeed in our efforts, or indeed improve anything (even if we did succeed in our efforts)? It will simply be a case of the 'same wine, in a new bottle'. He needs to consider that the rapid success of the IRM has indeed been due to this attempt to adhere to the evidence and truth in all circumstances, even when it may not appear to benefit us in the short-term. Ultimately it will be truth that will power us to victory, not any short-term expedient measures. We hope this article will inspire Puranjana to look deeper within himself and work on self-reform, and edit the anarthas that he sees so clearly in the GBC, out of his own life. In doing so he will be much more effective in his campaign, and a valuable asset rather than just another variation of the GBC lying machine. Puranjana clearly wants to see the current Guru system dismantled. The IRM is dedicated to doing just this, and is currently engaged in a legal battle, as well as many other measures, to bring about the necessary changes. We hope Puranjana will be able to assist this battle once he has been able to suitably re-orientate himself back towards the path of truth.

In conclusion we wish to state that we have no desire to enter into any more discussions on this issue. We will let the matter rest here and get back to our real work of re-instating Srila Prabhupada's orders. It should be very clear to everyone by now where the IRM stands and where PADA stands. We are not concerned with whatever new fabrications that Puranjana may try and 'hit back' with. He has been caught well and truly here with his hands in the cookie jar, and exposed as lying, and no amount of further mud-slinging at the IRM will ever change that. We hope his well-wishers will urge him to see sense and give up such attacks. Even in Kali-Yuga it is said that the 'last leg of religion' - 'truthfulness' - is still standing. It seems ironic that vaisnavas are unable to maintain even this minimum level of religiosity.

Satyam ki vijayate!

Yours in the service of Srila Prabhupada, IRM

FULL ARTICLE HERE: http://www.iskconirm.com/docs/webpages/pada_fighting_lies.html

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'You Are Also A Child-Chopper!' with Janardana Das, Chandra Shaker, Prahlad Das & Tim Lee (FB 13/7/13)

Chandra Shaker's original post in 'PRABHUPADANUGAS ONLY' FaceBook Group:

Why not set some rules and regulations for posting in these groups? No personal attacks are permitted on any Prabhupanuga devotees with the exception of any serious deviations which may endanger other devotees. This means only posts of a positive nature in line with Srila Prabhupadas teachings can be made in these groups. Bogus gurus and sinister Iskcon activities etc. can still be exposed and reported and all content should be Krsna Conscious in nature.. The devotees can decide by posting their views this way it prevents the infighting which is unproductive and certainly not pleasing to Srila Prabhupada. Anyone who continues to post articles directly attacking other Prabhupadanuga devotees in the group should be given three chances maximum and if they continue then they should be blocked from the groups. Just a suggestion its up to the group members to decide though. Hare Krsna.

COMMENTS:

Janardana Das: If we can't post legitimate concerns within this Prabhupadanuga community, where can we post them? How can the ritviks address this bad element in this community, if we can't even pose legitimate concerns? Truth must be spoken.... if a thief is a thief it is our duty to point this out for the benefit of the whole collective group, so they do not get cheated. Is it not? This is just like lancing a boil. Where was this "rules and regulations" proposition when Rupa manjari, or Prahlad das were being attacked so violently, and continue to be attacked?. So far there are hundreds of devotees and growing anxious to see a resolution to the offensive/aggressive nature of pada1008. Milk touched by the lips of a serpent contaminates everything....everything is spoiled.

Chandra Shaker: Yes if there is actual factual evidence that the thief is theif then they can be considered as deviating and a threat to other devotees as i pointed out. However the problem is it seems the motivation is personal grudges that cause the fighting and no evidence is actually presented. Other than speculations and accusations.

Janardana Das: I can understand what you mean, however again I was completely impartial to this whole controversy until a friend of mine (Prahlad das ) was attacked and accused of being a "child chopper".. as unbelievable as that sounds I now have opened my eyes to the real problem, The facts are as follows: The ritviks are considered by the devotional community to be angry/offensive/hateful/malicious/disinformation. I know also for a fact that this perception is directly connected with Pada1008. We can continue to go down this road, or acknowledge the problem and stop the poison from spreading... make appropriate reconciliations and move on in a positive way, full of new and renewed energy.

Janardana Das: It's not hard to make a blog and post nice positive advancements in the ritvik field, If pada1008 is removed from the internet as hate speech, I know several qualified devotees who can fill that void without the hate and aggressiveness that pada1008 contains. Possibly even repair the damage caused.

Janardana Das: It's just that pada1008 has so much free time on his hands... he can afford to do these things all day, Others have jobs...and householder duties to tend to. However I am confident that together a more positive perception of ritviks can be achieved through the right spirit of cooperation.

Chandra Shaker: Its simple Puranjana has to present the original letter from Mukunda that states the Gurukul kids should be chopped up and fed to the dogs. I think some of PADAs blogs are very good and informative, i dont think blocking him or singling him out as the culprit is right. The Mukunda group and Puranjana have been at each other for years so its about time it was resolved. All they have to do is stop attacking each other from what i understand Pada has already agreed to this.?

Janardana Das: I also agree that some of padas blogs are very good and informative... i really do prabhu, BUT what did Prabhupada say about milk touched by the lips of a serpent?

Prahlad Das: There is no 'child-chopping' letter. Neither Sanat, Mukunda or anyone has ever said this. Devotees have been asking Tim for 15 years to show this letter. Tim has just been repeating this 'child-chopper' lie to discredit anyone who exposes his blaming Prabhupada for the child-abuse, his malicious lies about sincere devotees, his demoniac lifestyle, etc...

Chandra Shaker: Can you really say he is a serpant? If you have some evidence or proof to support that fair enough present it for the benefit of others...99% of his blogs are on the "Guru issue" which we are all in agreement with.

Janardana Das: It's more of an analogy, I dont actually know if he is a naga serpent... but his actions seem to indicate some serious personality/character flaws. Do you think Srila Prabhupada would be happy with Pada1008?

Chandra Shaker: Then if the letter was never written then Puranjana will have to explain why he made these accusations...if they are blatent lies then its up to the group to decide if he is blocked.

Janardana Das: agreed. This is positive and constructive discussion that should have happened years ago...

Chandra Shaker: Lets hope so...lol.. Hare Krsna. Its up to the group so everyone will have to let us know their opinion on the matter and Puranjana also allowed to present his case.. Producing some evidence of the letter would be a good start.

Janardana Das: agreed. Proper leadership and maturity are very good qualities to have. Thank you Chandra Shaker for stepping up to at least accomidate the dialogue needed to move forward with this issue. Hare Krsna.

Prahlad Das: I have seen a copy of the only actual letter/eMail that Sanat sent to the Gurukulis in 1993. In it he sympathises with them and encourages them to fight back against the abusers. His writing 'style' is quite strong and somewhat 'unfocused' but his poin...See More...

Prahlad Das: Sanat in action (02:20) http://youtu.be/jN0py20UrB4

Janardana Das: Didnt' Geroge Bush SR. say " If you tell a lie enough times people will come to believe it" ? Typical demoniac strategy...

Prahlad Das: Apparently Hitler said that about repeating a lie. Bush Jr said "You are either with us or you are with the terrorists", just like Tim PADA says "You are with me or you are with the 'child-choppers'".

Janardana Das: Ah yes.. thank you for the correction, Well I guess I am a child chopper then. I should probably warn my wife not to bring my child near me. As he will be subject to "chopping"... But what if, there is a serious problem within a sociey that needs to be addressed for the benefit of the collective group? Prabhupada said we must discuss issues "thread bare"... until the issue is resolved. This issue is a practical example of how to apply Prabhupadas teaching to a society... this is a lesson for us to learn and get past, so that we can serve Srila Prabhupada better.

Tim Lee: Un-moderated forums dry up, that is proven whatever the topic is, even mundane forums that have a few people shouting others down lose members. This was supposed to be a forum about Prabhupada, and some people here wanted to talk about me and not Prabhupada...

Janardana Das: This will not dry up, I assure you prabhu, as you are very serious offender... there will be a solution to this problem one way or another. By the way have you found the child chopper letter yet?

Tim Lee: Prahlad just posted a letter a few days ago saying that these offenders (the children) need to be dropped on upraised swords? He posted that himself? Are you people reading what you are yourself posting? Or am I arguing with a ghost here? ys pd

Prahlad Das: Here we go... All the same old lies and nonsense.

Janardana Das: So your convinced that by "offender" he meant "the children" and not the actual abusers who were involved in the crimes towards the children?

Tim Lee: Mukunda also sayd the Prabhupadanuga groups are bogus cults, its on their web site?

Prahlad Das: Stop changing subject, rascal.

Janardana Das: Im not interested in hear say, I want the original letter that you have quoted for so long... Im talking about the accusation of Prahlad das being a child chopper. Dont swtich subject matters. Its very simple, do you have proof that Prahlad Das is a child chopper or not? yes or no...

Tim Lee: Yes, just a few days ago Prahlad posted a letter saying the children need to be placed on upraised swords, nevermind what I said or did not say, that is what he just now said.

Prahlad Das: More lies.

Janardana Das: show it to us.

Tim Lee: Yes, he wants children to be place on upraised swords, he wants to chop them up, yes he just posted that?

Janardana Das: I havent seen it.. provide link please.

Tim Lee: Prahlad posted that

Prahlad Das: Sanat said that, according to scripture, offenders of pure devotees (ie. Tim Lee supporting a lawsuit which blamed Prabhupada for the abuses) would suffer in such ways, not the children.

"If you are always remembering Him by your activities and seeing Krishna everywhere, even in the heart of the demonic persons, then anger will never overcome you, being purified of all false pride. But occasionally if there is good reason, ...you may have to become angry just to chastise the evil doers and blasphemers. We have seen that Lord Caitanya once nearly killed Jaghai and Madhai for their offenses to His devotee, so like that, if there is offensive behavior to the pure devotees you may become like Nrsinghadeva and punish them severely." (Prabhupada Letter Niranjan, 72-8-29)

Tim Lee: He posted in on the forums. I quoted him, he posted it here on FB forums.

Janardana Das: You completely twisted the words Tim Lee. That is not what he said

Prahlad Das: That is what scripture says about the fate of offenders like Tim.

Tim Lee: No they said the children are saying blasphemy, And blasphemers need to be placed on upraised swords, Preahlad just said that

Janardana Das: again, all of us here require some sort of proof... we know your words cannot be trusted tim.. so until you provide proof... you have lost this debate.

Tim Lee: I do not need to prove anything, Prahlad just posted that

Prahlad Das: Yes you are blasphemer against Prabhupada, implicating him in child-abuse!

Tim Lee: The children are blasphemers, and blasphmers need to be placed on upraised swords, that is what they were saying.. I said the children are commiting suicide, and I stopped that almost to nothing. So PRahlad wanted them to die

Janardana Das: I can't connect this logic..

Prahlad Das: No, you are blasphemer and scripture says you will be punished.

Tim Lee: The lawsuit stopped the suicides, ask Jvalamujki

Janardana Das: ..it's too advanced for me.. anyways, you cannot provide the letter or any proof as we ve asked you too.. so there is nothing more to discuss. All that is left now is to discuss your fate..

Tim Lee: The lawsuit stopped the suicides, and you cannot understand that suicides are bad?

Janardana Das: here we go.... tim lee logic..

Tim Lee: So you also wanted the children to die and we can report that is your opinion. Sanat and Mukunda were told that the children were commiting suicides, and that the lawsuit was stopping the suicides, and they were angry as fire, they wanted the children to die

Janardana Das: Here we go devotees, it was just a matter of time before tim's powerful connective logic began to surface.

Tim Lee: Prahlad supports that, yes, the children were commiting suicide, and Janardana did not want that to stop?

Janardana Das: Again, we need the letter.

Tim Lee: Why does Janardana want dead children?

Janardana Das: please provide it.

Tim Lee: Prahlad posted one of them, upraised swords

Prahlad Das: Not true.

Tim Lee: If I post you would not accept anyway, so go look at what he posted, he already posted on of several letters where they said the offenders need to go on swords. OK, I helped stop the suicides, and they did not want that, duh, that means they wanted dead children

Janardana Das: Actually Janardana wants peace... and to root out this divisive counterproductive mentality.. I will accept what makes sense and is provable.. not twisted logic and lies..

Tim Lee: OK so you are not answering the point, the children were commiting suicide and the lawsuit helped reduce that, are you saying you favor suicides of children? Just answer yes or no

Janardana Das: Didn't you implicate Prabhupada in the lawsuit as being an accessory? That was your lawsuit yes?. so you admit.

Tim Lee: So you wanted the suicides, yes. You wanted dead children.Yoiu admit. you are also a child chopper, you admit

Prahlad Das: What an idiot.

Janardana Das: I'm going to stop this discussion until a mature senior vaisnava comes forth to offer his expertise.

Tim Lee: Why are you a child chopper is the question then?

Janardana Das: no kidding... so pathetic.

Tim Lee: Ok so the lawsuit reduced the suicides, and you wante the suicides, its simple. Yes you wanted PRabhupada to be implicated in suicides

Prahlad Das: YOU are simple.. Simply a demonic rascal fool.

Tim Lee: You wanted his children to die

Prahlad Das: Pathetic.

Janardana Das: I really hope the mature vaisnavas of this forum are reading this and can see how pathetic Tim Lee's arguments and accusations are... his twisted logic..

Tim Lee: Anyway, you have eplained yourselves well, you wanted to have PRabhupada implicated in suicides of children. You wanted the children to die, thats all there is to it

Janardana Das: can you provide the quote where I said that?

Tim Lee: yes you just said that saving the children from suicide is twisted and wrong, that means you want them to die, that means you are a child chopper. You just admit yourself

Janardana Das: I did not say that LOL. so this is why people are not taking you seriously Tim Lee... and why you are a detriment to the ritvik community at large... I hope that I presented myself properly to all of the senior vaisnavas in this forum...and I hope we can all agree to put an end to PADA666... i mean 1008.

Tim Lee: OK, you said saving them is wrong? Saving children from dying is wrong, that makes you a person who wants dead children

Prahlad Das: Tim, we know that you severely neglected your own children.

Tim Lee: Everyone can figure that out, you want suicides, that means you want children to die. Ok so either you wanted dead children or you did not, you folks say you do, what else can I say? You wanted these children to die, thats not even nelgect, thats -- dead.

Janardana Das: It is actually very painful for me to continue this with you tim lee prabhu.... you make absolutely no sense... and are extremely offensive.. I am confident that you have exposed yourself for what I see you as..... an inside mole.

Prahlad Das: WE NEVER WANTED CHILDREN DEAD! GET IT?

Janardana Das: Prahlad it's ok... lets just wait for the mature vaisnavas to show up...and offer their opinion.

Tim Lee: Yes, you want dead children and you just admit that, you said our saving them was wrong, that means you wanted them to die, you are a child chopper yourself. Yes, you said saving them was wrong, that means you wanted them dead

Janardana Das: After all, Tim Lee could not provide any documentation where you say you support child chopping... he has been defeated.

Tim Lee: I provided it, Prahlad said put these offensive people on upraised swords, that is what they were saying about the children, they are offenders. Anyway, heh heh heh, you guys have to prove that upraised swords does not chop people up, good luck.

Janardana Das: Ladies and Gentlemen.... I give you Tim Lee, Pada1008, lets all give him a round of applause for his very powerful and intelligent debating skills.

Tim Lee: Anyway, sorry, many of the kulis were outraged at the Sanat and Mukunda program that was asking for them to be chopped up, ask them.

<At this point Chandra Shaker deleted the entire post & all of the above comments>

Chandra Shaker: I deleted that last post i dont want held responsible for causing even more fighting...sorry you can continue as you wish im taking a back seat on this topic for now. Hare Krsna.

Prahlad Das: Well done, censoring an important post with dozens of comments, wasting devotees time, and protecting a poisonous person. Well done prabhu. Good service.

Janardana Das: well they say that this is the age of "revealing"...how interesting, we all knew of tim lees character... that was obvious. Now we are learning the character... the true self of chandra shakar... I am actually shocked at this. Thankfully prahlad saved the thread which clearly shows tim lee defeated and babbling like a mad man. Is tim lee your ritvik priest guru chandra shekar prabhu? Did he give you the gayatri tape? what sort of mind control spell are you under prabhu? Sincerely cry to Prabhupada and he will guide you. I wish you well prabhu. Hare krsna. Agtsp...

Narada-kunda Dasi: "Therefore, what you have said in darkness will be heard in the daylight, and what you have whispered in private rooms will be shouted from the housetops." Luke 12:

20 False Statements made by Tim Lee (PADA)

Below are 20 false statements (nonsense, malicious lies) out of 100's that Tim Lee has published on his krishna1008 blog just over the last few months. We are still waiting for him and his sidekick William Acbsp to provide any kind of evidence for these crazy accusations.

1: "Sanat / Mukunda / Prahlad were promoting the worship of Satan as if it were the worship of Jesus"

2: "The only people who have been crying like lost little babies since 2002 over Tamal's departure are his top disciples and / or supporters like Sanat -- Prahlad -- Mukunda -- Janardan"

3: "The Prahlad team reports to us on a regular basis their being upset with Krishna for being such a violent person who killed their lord and master Tamal, because they miss licking the bottom of Tamal's shoes"

4: "Sanat / Mukunda / Prahlad / Pancali / Nicklaus Evans want women to be beaten"

5: "Prahlad wants to take down the Prabhupadanugas, he is a GBC mole. What else?"

6: "Sanat / Mukunda / Prahlad/ support Gaudiya Matha deviant acharyas program"

7: "Prahlad's real agenda is all along, he wants to have the Vaishnavas who do not worship homosexual pedophile guru programs assassinated!"

8: "On their web site the Sanat / Mukunda / Prahlad / Janardana / Bhakta das team attacks us profusely for our program of cutting off the supply line of children going to the ISKCON Auschwitz / molestation program"

9: "Prahlad is angry because we exposed the child molesting pooja and guru poisoning program, so he wants to have us killed (aka Monkey On A Stick) to punish us for exposing his REAL agenda"

10: "In fact some of the leaders of this child molester protecting and promoting group such as Sanat / Mukunda / Prahlad / Pancali had a web site that said these children needed to be killed, chopped up and fed to dogs"

11: "Why is Prahlad kissing the ground where the defenders of the molester messiahs program walk, ok like Bhakta das? Why is Prahlad always kissing the jackboots of the molester messiah program supporters? Now we know why, because he wants to have the devotees of Srila Prabhupada killed so the molester pooja agenda will prevail"

12: "Sanat and Mukunda are totally upset that some children even lived. These children are in part their victims, since they were supporters of the bogus gurus when all this was going on"

13: "Prahlad told us we are offenders for not promoting his anti-semite neo-nazi web site. He is a jack booter."

14: "Prahlad actually supports the people who said we need to chop up these children, so he wants to dish out even worse karma to the victims of his program"

15: "Prahlad is now licking the jack boots of Bhakta and Radhanath, he is licking the jack boots of the leaders of the molester messiahs program"

16: "Bhakta das has also expressed his support for Radhanath, and now the Sanat / Mukunda / Prahald / Pancali team are glorifying the Bhakta das program"

17:"Bhakta das is now being forwarded as a great speaker and authority not only by the GBC's guru groupies program, but also by the Prahlad / Sanat / Mukunda / Pancali team"

18: "They love the supporters of the child molester pooja program like Bhakta das, and they despise anyone who does not lick the boots of the pedophile messiahs program cheer leaders as their program is doing"

19: "The Prahlad group attacks even children never mind others. And some of the children Prahlad attacked had to leave FB and close their page, because Prahald's campaign against these children was making them physically sick. He wants to drive out the people who want to glorify Prabhupada, while claiming to be a follower of Prabhupada"

20: "We have not heard anything from Prahlad so far"

YOU ARE WITH 'THEM'! WHO IS 'THEM'? with Krishna Kirtan & Tim Lee

FaceBook Conversation with Krishna Kirtan & Tim Lee

Krishna Kirtan: I can deal with coherence and being civilized. Even Ravana was somewhat civilized. But you do not afford even a civilized conversation.

Tim Lee: OK, dead children, yep, you have no idea what that is because you have no heart. Dead children, you are for that, and you are civilized? You are for the child killers, and you are civilized? You have to be koking, really, you want dead children and this is civlized.

Krishna Kirtan: you have lost your mind.

Tim Lee: No, you are for the child killers, you just said so, you just said svaing them was bad. No I am repeating you?

Krishna Kirtan: and you're upset. There is no dialog with someone who is upset.

Tim Lee: You said that you wanted the children to die, and you are not upset? Because you are for the children killers.

Krishna Kirtan: hahahah. So I'm a child killer now.

Tim Lee: Yes, you said that the lawsuit that slowed the suicides was bad, and now you are laughing, you are laughing at dead people? Yes, you are for that agenda, you just admitted that.

Krishna Kirtan: The lawsuit's purpose was to further destroy Srila Prabhupada's movement. If it had been for a good purpose, sure.

Tim Lee: Anyway, so when children are molested and they are commiting suicides, you want the suicides and no help, you are with that agenda. Well its almost stopped the suicides, you say suicide is a good purpose? Are you nuts, suicided are a good purpose?

Krishna Kirtan: How are you working to put the perpetrators behind bars? Oh no, instead let's drum up a lawsuit and put the entire society into debt, on the back of ALL devotees, most who had nothing to do with any abuse.

Tim Lee: So you wanted more suicides, how does that help the world? You want dead children, that is your plan to fix things?

Krishna Kirtan: You did not answer my argument. What's the use of a lawsuit if the perpetrators are still running things? Tell me.

Tim Lee: The society would have been in the news as a suicide cult, that was your plan?

Krishna Kirtan: Well, it sure was in the news.

Tim Lee: The newspapers would have eventually figured out there was a huge suicde wave here. That would have destroyed the society anyway.

Krishna Kirtan: With none other than your jewish friend Jagadish putting all the blame on Srila Prabhupada.

Tim Lee: MY plan at least curbed the suicides, so it also saved lives.

Krishna Kirtan: Who so hypocriticaly was the very minister of education of ISKCON during the abuse.

Tim Lee: Jaggadish was trying to get me killed, how is he my friend?

Krishna Kirtan: Your so called plan was meant to fail, and it did. Although it backfired.

Tim Lee: Nothing back fired, I wanted to slow the suicides and it worked.

Krishna Kirtan: You just leave me alone, and go on with your work.

Tim Lee: You need mental help, you say the people who wanted to kill me are my friends.

Krishna Kirtan: I simply want to read the lotus words from Srila Prabhupada's books. That is my only solace.

Tim Lee: You said our saving the children was bad, you wanted them to die, you are sikc.

Krishna Kirtan: Go away. I heard enough of you.

Tim Lee: Yes, well i am glad to know you wnat chidlren to die. Very nice guy you are there.

Krishna Kirtan: Remember I'm one of those kids.

Tim Lee: And you wanted your friends to die, you are sick.

Krishna Kirtan: Maybe, and you are an idiot.

Tim Lee: Jvalamukhi said the lawsuit helped them from suicides and you wanted the suicides. She said the lawsuit helped her from suicide, you wanted her to die.

Krishna Kirtan: whatever. bye.

Tim Lee: You want your friends to die, nice frien you are. Yes, dead children are whatever for you.

Krishna Kirtan: One more comment from you on my wall and I will expose you, you rascal. Leave me alone.

Tim Lee: You do not care about your friends dying, you are sick. Go expose, me I will expose you as a person who wants dead children.

Tim Lee: yep. Dead children lover, bye bye, I will get nothing, you are a sick person, I have seen thousands of you all along, you wanted dead children, you are sick.

Krishna Kirtan: harer nama evakevalam! The interesting thing, is that all of your verbal abuse does nothing to affect me. I only grow stronger. Really.

Tim Lee: Yes, you people who love child killers are very strong, you are only worried about money, that means you are the king of the Jews.

Krishna Kirtan: I want fighting with no one. I want only peace. So please, you specially, do not come into my life, on my facebook, or anywhere near me. I want nothing to do with you and your pathetic works.

Tim Lee: You and your Jew pals said, of dead children is fine, we are worried about money, you are a Jew ytourself.

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Mathias Sabji: Heavy !

Now you are also a child killer or chopper ?

This is really too much. I thing Puranjana Prabhu needs help.

Some of the senior Vaisnavas must speak with him.

He has has done many nice and heroic service to Prabhupada... It is a fact ! And we should not forget it! But now he needs our help .....

Now I think because his mind is too much and too deep in such negative topics , this has infected his mind due to the resonance law. Therefore he need little help now.

When we want become real Vaisnavas then we must handle this situation like a gentlemen!Prabhupada said that a Vaisnava is always , in all circumstances a Gentlemen!

But yes ! When a Vaisnava is offended by other Devotees or by non devotees we should become very angry ......

I think a mix of this both instruction is needed now ...... To be angry because of this Vaisnava aparadha (child killer bla bla ) and in same time be a gentlemen and let us help Puranjana Prabhu also.

He is still a real Prabhupadanuga and he need some help now brothers and sisters!

When some of us have nice relationship of some of Puranjana Prabhus elder First generation Prabhupada disciples , then he or she can bring this issue to this Senior Vaisnava because otherwise such Vaisnava aparadha destroys our brother Puranjana Prabhu ! Therefore he need held immediately !

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Narada-kunda Dasi: "mathias prabhu, we have been waiting for a long time for some senior intervention. finally it came a couple of days ago, but only to protect tim as "their man" so he can continue doing what he does... and what he is doing is exactly what someone out to destroy prabhupada's movement would be doing. it can only be done from the inside, as prabhupada told us... i know it is hard for an honest person to think that someone else may not be honest, but we have to consider things impartially, in the light of prabhupada's teachings. if someone is acting as an enemy, and showing bad qualities, what is there to make him a devotee? only his initiated name (which he does not even use)? or his past exposure of iskcon? the motive with which one acts is the essential factor."

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Nara Narayan Dasa Vishwakarma:
"He is actually not a Prabhupadanuga, but a person very envious of SP who has fooled many sincere devotees of the last few decades, and he "wallows" in his perception of having fooled the innocent. He never apologized to SP in 1975, but raged out the door without even offering obeisances to SP! Fortunately, real Prabhupadanugas are not all like that!"

"I agree with Mathias Sabji when he says that "all Vaishnavas, when sick need help from senior devotees who speak as gentlemen. Krishna Kirtan prabhu, did NOT react (mostly). He countered Tim's insanity with neutrality and reason.
Without Krishna Kirtan openly rejecting him and openly disagreeing with him Tim almost became timid, and put his "insane repetitions" of vulgarity one line at a time, but he could not restrain himself, and at the end of the dialogue, began to "heap" up his psychotic rantings. I am prepared to offer conditional friendship to Tim in exchange for Tim making whatever points he wants using quotes from SP as his genuine Authority.
Has anyone ever asked Tim to only quote SP, and not make up this crazy stuff"
In any event, it is best to remove him from the Internet (however possible). At this point Tim serves no one....least of all himself!"

"Windle-Turley attacked prabhupada as running a "RICO" racket (Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations), and made Him the "bad guy"....Tim Lee gave a short testimony which supported the lawsuit. Gupta was the lawyer for Iskcon who worked very hard to reduce the amount of money that the Abuse victims would receive. He pared it down to about $6,000.00 each!

As far as I know, the Lawsuit did not halt the suicides, or even slow them down. As far as I know there were not more than a half dozen suicides. My daughter Shakuntala would know.
There have been a total of 14 suicides from the gurukula, and that is a lot...But the lawsuit did not slow or stop the suicides. I knew of two suicides that occurred years after the Court Settlement. No one mentioned Tim Lee's name, nor was he involved in the slightest.
Tim Lee refers to Krishna Kirtan as the "King of the Jews".....a title normally reserved for Jesus Christ!l Tim Lee and Yasodanandana were both raised Catholics, and both of them were molested by Catholic priests. But this was long before the Catholic Church Scandals swept the Globe. Mathias Sabji has made some very good points about the need to "help" Tim Lee.....but HOW?"

"I, along with Mathias Sabji prabhu would like to rescue Tim Lee and see him blissfully engaged in high level Katha regarding SP and the Future of SP's Movement, ISKCON guided now by our ever expanding Prabhupadanuga movement. This is all I could hope for in this lifetime.
Nonetheless, if a "crazy" person endangers others, he cannot be ignored, and I think that the mildest self-defense is to join strongly and with great intent with others, who have seen exactly HOW dangerous Tim Lee is to the future of Srila Prabhupada's movement. What he does simply cannot be allowed to continue to go on.
Tim Lee has posted this sort of offensive garbage against the DOM and me personally for at least 28 years, and no one could see that this was wrong and that Tim Lee should be removed from any place that he can sow hatred and disharmony to so many victims. My only reason for posting as I have above, is that I have very close connection with all of the topics that Tim Lee brought out above."

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Bhakti Ananda Goswami II:
"From such exchanges it is apparent that Tim is seriously mentally ill. No one should take offense to what he says, but everyone should try cooperatively to do something about the mad-elephant injury that his ranting and raving is causing to other Devotees and the damage that it is doing collectively to Sri Sri Gaura-Nitai's and Srila Prabhupada's Hari Nama Sankirtan Mission.

We have seen how many persons have IN WRITING been called things like "child choppers" and "child rape" party members. We have seen so many innocent Devotees accused of involvement, even as accessories after the fact, in the crimes of murders, child rapings, beatings and even poisoning Srila Prabhupada. These false accusations have been in print, which makes them libel."

"I have been a victim of Tim & Company's libel and threats for years, but because He / they have hurt many good Devotees that I venerate as saintly, Devotees that I love, who are still 'in' ISKCON, and others who are not. I have had to fear for my family's safety. Tim's libelous ranting has inspired DEADLY fanaticism around the world. I have received SCORES of death threats in the mail filled with the same insane accusations that he has screamed from the rooftops.

I do not want the innocent Devotees among the Prabhupadanugas, the Ritviks or other ISKCON-related camps to be libeled by Tim any longer. He is not trying to do anything but promote himself and doesn't care who he USES to do it. He is what some of my grand children would call a emo "drama king" who emotionally lives on the drama that he creates by constantly agitating the minds and hearts of others. He appropriates and uses whatever he wants from others with no conscience at all. He lies when he cannot find any real dirt on someone."

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Nara Narayan Dasa Vishwakarma:
"It is our clear duty to stop Tim Lee, and to create a system around SP that prevents any crazy person from going so far as he has. Tim Lee is delusional, and such people CANNOT be allowed to disturb the activities of those sincere souls who want to serve SP authentically.
In 1974, Bali Mardan gave up his Sannyas order to marry Taitreyi who was supposed to be the heiress to the Toyota Zaibatzu fortune. After they were married, Taitreyi was caught offering Chinese chicken egg rolls to Radha and Krishna. No one dared to intervene, because Bali Mardan was their "authority". When SP found out about this He was furious! He said, "any ordinary member of the temple should have stopped this practice". So by that example, He gave us the clear instruction to TAKE IT UPON OURSELVES to solve these ordinary problems as self evident. For Tim Lee to rant and lie and slander for twenty five years is NOT HIS FAULT... IT IS OURS!"