Saturday, 19 April 2014

Kirtan Standards - Srila Prabhupada's Instructions

 
Prabhupada quotes regarding Kirtan standards and the public presentation of Krsna consciousness:

"My opinion is that it is not necessary for us to utilize these different musical talents for spreading Krsna Consciousness. I would rather see people follow strictly the path of Lord Caitanya and His Sankirtana devotees. We are using mrdanga, karatala, that is enough. We are not musicians. We are Krsna bhaktas. Therefore we do not stress so much importance on these different musical talents. Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu is God Himself. Had He thought it would have been better to spread Krsna Consciousness by another way He would have done so. But no, simply with mrdanga and karatala, traveling and chanting Hare Krsna, asking everyone to chant Hare Krsna, preaching simply Srimad-Bhagavatam philosophy, this is the process. There is no need for us to try and add anything to this simple method. It will only be a distraction." (Prabhupada Letter to Jagadish Pandit 74-12-28)

"I never thought about the audience. I was prepared to chant even if there were no men present to hear me. The principle of chanting is to glorify the Lord & not to attract a crowd. If Krishna hears nicely then he will ask some sincere devotee to gather in such place. Therefore be advised that thousands of centers may be started if we find out a sincere soul for each & every center." (Prabhupada Letter 67-11-12)

"Krishna kirtana is not meant for entertaining the public for demonstration of arts. It is dynamic service to the Lord. We do not therefore mind so much about the artistic presentation of Krishna kirtana but we want to see how much a devotee is satisfying the Supreme Will." (Prabhupada Letter to Jadurani 67-12-12)

"Practicing is already done by kirtana. It is not required for us to become artists. Our main point is service to Krishna, not to please an audience. We shall not divert our attention too much to adjustment of musical sounds. People should not misunderstood that we are a band of musical artists. They must know that we are devotees of Krishna. Our devotional practice and purity shall be so strong that wherever we chant there will be immediately an impression in the audience for devotion to Krishna." (Prabhupada Letter to Tamala Krishna 69-10-30)

"Our process is to show Krishna Consciousness as it is, not as others want to see it. By showing KC in this way, you are making the thing less important. It is not that we should change to accommodate the public, but that we should change the public to accommodate us.. If we simply present Krishna Consciousness in a serious and attractive way, without need to resort to fashionable slogans or tricks, that is sufficient. Our unique asset is our purity. No one any where can match it. That will be noticed eventually and appreciated, as long as we do not diminish or neglect the highest standard of purity in performing our routine work, not that we require to display or announce ourselves in very clever ways to get attention. No, our pure standard is enough. Let us stand on that basis." (Prabhupada Letter to Yogesvara 71-12-28)

"So far the Road Show and this Yoga Village are concerned, these things should be stopped. Simply perform our kirtana. If we divert our attention in this way, the whole thing will gradually deteriorate.. All these things are nonsense inventions. Such inventing spirit will ruin our this movement. People may come to see, some will become devotees, but such devotees will not stay because they are attracted by some show and not by the real thing or spiritual life according to the standard of Lord Caitanya. Our standard is to have kirtana, start temples. What is this "Road Show" and "Yoga Village?" It will be another hippie edition. Gradually the Krishna Consciousness idea will evaporate: another change, another change, every day another change. Stop all this. Simply have kirtana, nothing else. Don't manufacture ideas." (Prabhupada Letter to Sudama 72-11-5)

"So far your road-show is concerned, we are not meant for giving performances, we are simple kirtana men. There must always be kirtana going on wherever we travel, and nothing else. In this connection refer to the GBC letter which will be sent to you shortly by Karandhara and Syamasundara." (Prabhupada letter to Kirtanananda 72-6-25)

*"One night there was a darsana with one musician. I never got the understanding whether this was a person coming to Krsna consciousness or whether this was already a devotee. I always thought it was someone coming to Krsna consciousness that wanted to use their western rock and roll guitar style in service to Lord Caitanya, and Prabhupada was very adamant, and the guy kept bringing the point up two or three times and finally Prabhupada said "No!" and he pointed, there was this beautiful picture of Panca-tattva on the wall of his room. He said "You see Mahaprabhu; kartalas and mrdanga, that is all." (Caturatma das: Memories of Srila Prabhupada DVD 51)

"Regarding your question of dancing-show, whatever it may be, it may not deviate from the real Krishna Consciousness program. We are Hari Kirtana men, that's all. We can attract people by some gorgeous show, but inside there must be strict purity and seriousness, otherwise, we shall be attracted by the gorgeous show only...here in London they had arranged one program of lecturing by me along with a recital by one man playing on the vina just to attract attention to my speaking. I am not in approval of such arrangements, and it will be dangerous thing in future if we begin this type of program just to attract the masses. Already I see this happening practically all over the Society, so better we stop it now and get ourselves firmly on the track chalked out for us by Lord Caitanya. We are simply Sankirtana men, our program is chanting, dancing, distributing prasadam, and speaking high philosophy, that's all." (Prabhupada Letter to Madhudvisa. 72-07-08)

"In India the system is that people go to see the Jagannatha Deity. The Deity is not very beautiful from the artistic point of view, but still people attend by the thousands. That sentiment is required. Similarly with our kirtana we are only using drums and karatalas, but people come to the point of ecstasy. It is not the ornamentation, it is the ecstasy. This ecstasy is awakened by sravanam kirtanam by devotees." (Prabhupada Letter to Dr. Wolf 76-01-29)

"We should not try to become a very popular musical party. Music is one of our items for chanting, but we are not musicians. We should always remember this fact. We take advantage of the typewriter but that doesn't mean we are professional typists." (Prabhupada Letter 69-07-02)

"The chanting is very effective. Along with tampura and mrdanga played very rhythmically, let them chant. Perform this musical demonstration and sell books as far as possible, and feasting." (Prabhupada Letter to Harikesa 76-10-28)

"Another proposal is that I want to form a sankirtana party in which two members will play mrdanga, eight will play the cymbals, two will play on tamboura, and one on harmonium. Besides that there will be the leader of the party. This party will be so trained that exhibitions of our chanting and dancing along with distribution of prasadam will be performed on a stage and for this performance we will sell tickets to the public. It will be known as a spiritual movement". (Prabhupada Letter to Hamsaduta 68-01-22)

"Regarding your question about kirtana, practically we are not concerned with the instruments. They are used sometimes to make it sweeter, but if we divert our attention for using the instruments more, that is not good. We can accept everything for Krishna's service, but not taking the risk of diverting attention to any other thing which will hinder our Krishna Consciousness. That should be our motto, or principle." (Prabhupada Letter to Jadurani 69-5-26)

"The harmonium may be played during bhajan if there is someone who can play melodiously. But it is not for kirtan and aratik." (SP Letter to Bahudak 76-01-11)

"With regard to your question about Bengali style kirtana and mrdanga playing, one or two styles is best. To introduce more styles is not good. It will become an encumbrance. Who is that Krsna das Babaji who is teaching? If we introduce so much emphasis on style of kirtana, then simply imitation will go on. Devotional emotion is the main thing. If we give stress to instrument and style then attention will be diverted to the style. That will be spiritual loss." (Prabhupada Letter to Satsvarupa 76-06-30)

"It is to be understood that when Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu chanted and danced, He did so by the influence of the pleasure potency of the spiritual world. Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu never considered the holy name of the Lord to be a material vibration, nor does any pure devotee mistake the chanting of the Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra to be a material musical manifestation. Lord Caitanya never tried to be the master of the holy name; rather He taught us how to be servants of the holy name. If one chants the holy name of the Lord just to make a show, not knowing the secret of success, he may increase his bile secretion, but he will never attain perfection in chanting the holy name." (C.C. Adi 7.95-96 p)

"When disciples do not stick to the principle of accepting the order of their spiritual master, immediately there are two opinions. Any opinion different from the opinion of the spiritual master is useless. One cannot infiltrate materially concocted ideas into spiritual advancement. That is deviation. There is no scope for adjusting spiritual advancement to material ideas."
(Caitanya-caritamrta Adi 12.9 purport)

"The order of the spiritual master is the active principle in spiritual life. Anyone who disobeys the order of the spiritual master immediately becomes useless." (Caitanya-caritamrta Adi 12.10)

"The service of the spiritual master is essential. If there is no chance to serve the spiritual master directly, a devotee should serve him by remembering his instructions. There is no difference between the spiritual master's instructions and the spiritual master himself. In his absence, therefore, his words of direction should be the pride of the disciple." (Caitanya-caritamrta Adi 1.35 Purport)

"We will establish hundreds of temples, and they will all be very opulent. But if we do not follow the instruction of the Spiritual Master, they will just be showbottle. Do you know what showbottle means? It means colored water in a bottle which looks just like medicine, but which does not work." (Room conversation NY July 1970)

Rama Govinda dasa: Is the greatest offence to disobey the guru?
Srila Prabhupada: Yes is the first offence. Gurur avajna sruti-sastra nindanam. If you accept guru and again disobey him, then what is your position? You are no a gentleman. You promise before guru, before Krishna, before fire, that I shall obey your order, I shall execute this, and again you do not do this. Then you are no even a gentleman, what to speak about devotee. This is common sense. (75-2-11)


Paramahamsa: Our position in preaching should be to encourage people in all respects to associate with us.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Paramahamsa: That means sometimes we might have to compromise in certain ways.
Prabhupada: Why compromise? You don't compromise. Then you associate with him. If you make compromise, then you associate with him. Then gradually you'll also go down. When we, when we see some person, we do not associate with him, but we give him chance to associate with me. Why you should make compromise? What is the reason? If you know something positively, why should you make compromise? When people come to talk with me, see me, I don't make any compromise. Do I make any compromise?
Devotees: No.
(Morning Walk Paris 74-7-11)

"Real success is how one is faithful to his guru. That is real success." (Lecture, October 4, 1976, Vrindavan)


"To honor the spiritual master means to carry out his instructions word for word." (SB 3.24.12 purport)


ISKCON London

ISKCON Bangalore

Akshaya Patra Jaipur

ISKCON Melbourne

Hare Krishna Band (India)

ISKCON Pattaya Thailand


Please see: Srila Prabhupada - No Compromise

Pratyatosa Dasa and his Anti-Prabhupada Ideas

The Feminist & The Freemason?

Pratyatosa Dasa presents himself as a senior 'ritvik' Prabhupadanuga... but he still supports his wife Urmila in her bid to become ISKCON's first female Diksha Guru! He also continues to argue that Srila Prabhupada was wrong and that the USA did go to the moon! And now he is supporting Hridayananda's 'Krishna West' deviation! Anyway, he has blocked us on FaceBook, as have his cohorts Tim Lee & William Acbsp. Why are they hiding?

Pratyatosa Dasa (ACBSP) November 19, 2012:
"I still stand by every word of what I wrote on this subject more than 9 years ago":

First Female Diksha Guru: http://www.vnn.org/editorials/ET0309/ET20-8357.html

Affirmative Action Urmila:
http://prabhupadavision.com/2012/11/affirmative-action/


"This moon landing issue is Krishna's trick to separate the blind followers from those who use their God given intelligence/common sense in the service of God (Krishna)." Ys, Pratyatosa Dasa
Srila Prabhupada A Conditioned Soul?:
http://harekrishnamalaysia.com/KRSNAinsight/2009/07/30/srila-prabhupada-a-conditioned-soul/


17 reasons to Bring Krishna West to Houghton, Michigan, USA: http://iskcon.us/pratyatosa/bring-krishna-west-houghton-michigan-usa/


"I'm convinced that if it weren't for the way in which Puranjana presented the relevant facts to the high powered lawyer, Windle Turley, the child abuse lawsuit, which reduced the number of gurukuli suicides almost to nil, would have never gotten off the ground. Therefore, I will be forever grateful to him for that reason alone." Your servant, Pratyatosa Dasa (19/12/10)


Yes, it was Pratyatosa, along with Puranjana (Tim Lee) and Nandini (Nori Muster), who compiled, supported and presented the lawsuit which blamed Srila Prabhupada for the Gurukuli child-abuse!


"No, I was never a member of the Freemasons. I didn't even know that my father was ever a member until I read his obituary! But I did have a Top-Secret security clearance when I was a young Navy officer stationed in Washington DC in 1968-69, so put that in your pipe and smoke it! :-)" Ys, Pratyatosa Dasa (13/10/13)

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UPDATE: Pratyatosa is now criticizing Prabhupada for making 'mistakes' such as referring to West Virginia as New Virginia. https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/istagosthi/3yMvCrRyoa4

Wednesday, 16 April 2014

'Shills and the Owning of Truth' by Krishna Kirtan Das

One thing that becomes evident quickly is how Puranjana's (Tim Lee/PADA/krishna1008) style of communication only benefits the bad guys, Alex Jones style. I have personally banned Tim Lee from my FaceBook wall long ago, and he knows why.

What kind of tactic is this? I don't care to find out who these guys really are (I highly suspect), but I will say this.

The manipulative individuals in this atheistic society running behind the scenes know well what is really going on from the very early beginning. Since they know that the truth can not be hidden, they come in early and appropriate themselves of it (own the narrative); in other words, become the 'owners' of the truth, start disseminating actual truth and subsequently gaining some credibility, but then later start to mix lies and misinformation within their material. And there is one key element: focus only on what's bad but never offer tangible solutions and never show interest in engaging in any type of honest dialog with others who may challenge their tone, in fact attack them instead. In other words, Cointel: Infiltrate your group, create disruption, and run off the reasonable pacifists within the group. That way the actually good and sincere can never influence or speak.

Not only that, but the Alex Jones style is all very well known now in all circles. That guy has been totally exposed as a hateful shill.

Anyway, so what ends up happening? That kind of approach actually ends up waking up some people in the course of their history, but for the most part alienating a whole host of others, because most thoughtful people and innocent objective truth seekers (which is the majority), are not interested in listening CONSTANTLY (I say constantly) to words such as "molester-messiahs, penis, child-chopping, homosexual pedophiles, penetrating this and that, kill, kill, kill, etc." on a constant basis. All things which may be true to a certain extent but the message carries a special mix: the CONSTANT endless tirade of hate. Not that some of it may not be justified, but the incessant use of non-objectivity is exactly their ultimate goal and objective. Tim Lee's record for instance shows precisely this.

This gets people, who don't see their game, divided and alienated (or accepting and partaking of his hate, great isn't it?), or hating the messenger and subsequently the message, or altogether dismissing any real objective facts, or worse yet: not learning anything at all and simply going away. Back to sleep!...

What motivates them to act in this way? Very simple. It's just a way to block the DOOR from the massive influx of the genuine who are interested in truth, which is a river flow. See, most people have 'normal' lives, are reasonable, therefore you must know HOW to talk with them, not simply WHAT to tell them. But instead what they do is simply alienate everyone on purpose, stealthy done sometimes over long periods of time.

So even within the awakened group of individuals, what happens? When such people are given the microphone and/or own it, everyone spends their time on the so-called 'justified' hate being spilled and not enough time on what really matters, which is the truth as it SHOULD be spoken and presented!

Tim Lee's material is a perfect example of hateful speech going on for decades.

My research informs me that this all simply a tactic, documented by many others in all branches of truth movements. If they were actually interested in truth, everyone would (and can) use a little more discretion in their manner of speech. Besides, all the 'hate' that needed to be said, has been already said NUMEROUS times. When is it ever going to stop? In the view of the shill it should never stop!


Over the years I did wake up to some of the things going around by reading Puranjana's material, but my reading of it was just enough to extract what I needed from it. His tone actually alienated me so much (it never changed) that I had considered him incoherent and unqualified to be speaking. His so-called leadership in these matters actually made me stay away from it all.

Swimming the river upstream can get pretty intense, because while learning the truth, being confronted with hard evidence, you nevertheless find that who is out there representing such evidence are elements who carry the tone and choice of presentation on par with the satanic urban dictionary.

As for myself, I never took him as some kind of superhero. I always felt that if I wanted to learn the truth I would have to read and learn from all, even the enemy's material. In other words, I had to think for myself, research for myself.

I would dare say that placing Puranjana (Tim Lee) as some kind of hero is simply fanatic excitement on the part of a newcomer, as if he/she has finally found their messiah. Not only that, but if Puranjana was for real he would humble himself and not be constantly bragging about what he claims he did, how much he did, or how incredible he thinks he is. (eg. saving the ex-Gurukulis from a 'suicide-epidemic).

All super heroic acts? Not really. His so-called heroic act in drumming up the Gurukuli lawsuit, simply contributed to something which was actually drafted and designed to further destroy ISKCON from within and from without, both sides cooperating from their respective positions.

Puranjana did alright, although I still suspect him of either having lack of communication etiquette (incompetence) or of working for the bad guys, likely both. Alex Jones did alright too, just like all the other 'truther' shills, including one of the most thoughtful and eloquent, namely David Icke, and others. All rascals!

(Krishna Kirtan)